<div><div dir="auto"><br></div></div><div dir="auto">You raise some very important questions.</div><div dir="auto">When we introduced the Code of Conduct in the first place, strong voices said that we do not need this.</div><div dir="auto">I still hear voices to the same respect, but not as strong.</div><div dir="auto">We are making progress but we still have a long way to go.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto"> I will have to appologise for my late reply from your escalation of the matter. </div><div dir="auto">That is clearly not acceptable and I will work on ways to improve that.</div><div dir="auto">(If you did not get my response, I am happy to resend)</div><div dir="auto">My response does however not change the substance of your message.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">I think you point to some important improvements that should be disscussed and implemented.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Eager to hear what the other TF members think. </div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Hans Petter</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr">On Mon, 11 Feb 2019 at 17:53, Sasha Romijn <<a href="mailto:sasha@mxsasha.eu">sasha@mxsasha.eu</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hello all,<br> <br> At the last RIPE meeting, we talked about our Code of Conduct. I offered to<br> send a good example. I’ve since also actually reported a CoC incident in the<br> RIPE community, and want to share some thoughts on that experience.<br> <br> Sending a CoC example took some time, as I’ve been refactoring and improving<br> the CoC for the Write the Docs community. Our new CoC is:<br> <a href="http://www.writethedocs.org/code-of-conduct/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.writethedocs.org/code-of-conduct/</a><br> <a href="http://www.writethedocs.org/code-of-conduct-response/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.writethedocs.org/code-of-conduct-response/</a><br> And these are the most significant changes:<br> <a href="http://www.writethedocs.org/blog/new-community-coc-2019/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.writethedocs.org/blog/new-community-coc-2019/</a><br> I’m happy to further explain the decisions behind it,<br> if you have any questions.<br> <br> I will not share the full details of the incident I reported in the RIPE<br> community, because I prefer not to be identified as the reporter. About<br> four months have passed since my report, and I have not received any reply<br> from the wg chairs or the RIPE chair, who are the designated contacts,<br> other than two notes that it was being worked on. I initially reported to<br> the relevant working group chairs, and then escalated to the RIPE chair,<br> as documented in the RIPE community CoC. To my knowledge, no action has<br> been taken.<br> <br> My general impression is that none of the people listed as CoC contacts in<br> any part of the RIPE community are able to effectively take action on a CoC<br> incident. Either because this is explicitly not part of their task (trusted <br> contacts) or, I suspect, they lack any kind of resources or possibly time<br> to handle an incident. That is *not* a failure on the part of any of these<br> people individually, but rather caused by a flawed and mostly absent process<br> and mandate to act.<br> <br> In addition, confidentiality of CoC reports is violated in every single report.<br> Both wg chair mailing lists and the trusted contacts address are moderated by<br> NCC staff, which means an unknown person(s) can also see the report, and<br> reporters are not made aware of this in advance. This can have severe<br> consequences, and makes reporting unsafe. The RIPE chair doesn’t seem to<br> have any publicly listed contact address at all.<br> <br> Personally I feel that the ability of the RIPE community to handle a CoC<br> incident is so abysmal, that we would be better off not publishing one at<br> all, as we are now creating a false sense of security.<br> <br> I should also note that this was a fairly minor incident, pretty much the most<br> trivial kind of incident a CoC contact has to deal with. The consequences of<br> the lack of ability to respond properly could be very severe in case of a more<br> serious incident - which have taken place in the RIPE community as well.<br> <br> The updated Code of Conduct for Write the Docs, along with our response guide,<br> handles many of these concerns specifically, so I suggest you have a look at it,<br> and see how it can be adopted for the RIPE community. However, in order to have<br> an effective CoC process, it will also require setting up one or more response<br> teams, which can be contacted privately, with publicly listed membership, and<br> most importantly, a mandate to act. Including, if needed, immediate removal of<br> a community member, including those in a position of power.<br> >From my personal experience, this is a quite rare measure, but it needs to be<br> on the table for the CoC to be effective.<br> <br> I’m not sure what the process would be to continue with this, or how others<br> feel - I’m curious to hear your ideas. But the apparent fact that the RIPE<br> community is currently unable to handle even the most trivial CoC reports,<br> makes it inherently unsafe.<br> <br> Sasha<br> _______________________________________________<br> diversity mailing list<br> <a href="mailto:diversity@ripe.net" target="_blank">diversity@ripe.net</a><br> <a href="https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/diversity" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/diversity</a><br> </blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"> -- Hans Petter Holen Mobile +47 45 06 60 54 | <a href="mailto:hph@oslo.net">hph@oslo.net</a> | <a href="http://hph.oslo.net">http://hph.oslo.net</a> </div>