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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">As my grandfather use to say. "If it
      ain't broke, don't fix it".<br>
      <br>
      I know it makes everyone feel good to have these pointless
      discussions and if that's what it takes by all means continue on,
      I do find them entertaining, but please, join reality. End of the
      day this is business, it costs money. Considering no rate
      increases and the fact that most years we've had a surplus so who
      cares if they blow a little money on hookers and coke, it's ok.
      RIPE provides us a good, reliable service and prompt turn around
      time on any requests. As someone else has said, try working with
      other RIRs. <br>
      <br>
      Anyways, carry on.<br>
      <br>
      <br>
      On 04/13/2018 02:03 AM, Huf Oliver, CI-A Rolls-Royce Power Systems
      AG wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:9f20ddd7dd404402b8589918fdad00c8@rrpowersystems.com">
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        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
            lang="EN-US">William,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
            lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
            lang="EN-US">while I don't feel competent enough to comment
            on the first part of your reply, I fully second the last
            paragraph!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
            lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
            lang="EN-US">Oliver.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
            lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <div>
          <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
            1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><b>Von:</b>
              members-discuss [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net">mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net</a>]
              <b>Im Auftrag von </b>William<br>
              <b>Gesendet:</b> Freitag, 13. April 2018 02:16<br>
              <b>An:</b> Aleksey Bulgakov
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:aleksbulgakov@gmail.com"><aleksbulgakov@gmail.com></a><br>
              <b>Cc:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net">members-discuss@ripe.net</a>; <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:agm@ripe.net">agm@ripe.net</a><br>
              <b>Betreff:</b> Re: [members-discuss] [ncc-announce] [GM]
              RIPE NCC Annual Report 2017 and Proposed RIPE NCC Charging
              Scheme 2019<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
              style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">Must
              be some joke (i hope at least).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">Russia
                does not have staff needs available unless you pay
                excessive (skilled are in fact leaving anyway, we have a
                bunch of Russians working from Cyprus nowadays), Russia
                is not politically stable (a stable autocracy is not
                politically stable overall) and the currency fluctuates
                between basically worthless and entirely worthless.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">Government
                control is excessive, freedom of business is low, growth
                is low, legal security is nil.... plus one more round of
                UN sanctions could cut off any RIPE member from paying
                invoices entirely.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">Russia
                is in no way suitable for RIPE (and in fact, Bulgaria
                has less tax than Russia anyway + a much more simple tax
                system + EU).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">In
                case of no joke... after speaking with some LIRs we'll
                boycott any attempts to move the NCC out of the EU and i
                assume from the statutes this requires a full member
                vote which is extremely unlikely to pass for Russia (or
                in practice anyone else).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
              style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                  style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">--<o:p></o:p></span></p>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                    style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">William
                    Weber<o:p></o:p></span></p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                    style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
              </div>
            </div>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">On
                Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 01:39, Aleksey Bulgakov <<a
                  href="mailto:aleksbulgakov@gmail.com"
                  moz-do-not-send="true">aleksbulgakov@gmail.com</a>>
                wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
            <div>
              <div>
                <div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
                    <div>
                      <div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><<a
                              href="mailto:david.ponzone@ipeva.fr"
                              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">david.ponzone@ipeva.fr</a>>:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
                      </div>
                      <blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid
                        #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
                        6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
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                          <p class="MsoNormal"
                            style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                              style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">AFAIK,
                              social charges paid by the employer in NL
                              are around 28%, so it's less than 3000
                              euros per month per staff member of
                              income.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"
                              style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">And
                                that's before social charges paid by the
                                employee (18%), so it's less than 2500€
                                of net income per staff.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"
                              style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"
                              style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
                                style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">I
                                would not judge if that's high or low in
                                NL, but that's not 4000€<o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                      </blockquote>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">So,
                        we can move the RIPE office to another country,
                        with less salary numbers. E.g. there are the
                        salary numbers approximately 1500€ in Russia,
                        including tax 13%. With social tax 30%
                        the salary numbers are 2000€ in Moscow. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
                  </div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">What
                        do you think about it? Me and my colleagues, who
                        wrote here earlier, are ready to help the
                        community with relocation.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  </div>
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      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
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</pre>
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